Oric V23 Modem

This is the right place to discuss on how to implement hardware vsync, adding a VIA or AY chipset, puting multiple roms, or how to design a new flash expansion card.
User avatar
Dbug
Site Admin
Posts: 3671
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:00 pm
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

Oric V23 Modem

Post by Dbug »

I managed to get an Oric V23 Modem, with the serial interface (see: it came with two tapes from Tansoft with the Prestel software.

I know this modem was also sold in France (it's tested in the issue 36, November 1987 of Théoric), so what I'm wondering is the following:
- Does anyone has the user manual
- Is it compatible with Cumulus/Microdisc/Cumana (it seems the interface is based on a 6551 ACIA, accessed by addresses #380 to #383)
- Is there some documentation for the RS232 interface?
- Other than this Tansoft Prestel software, does anyone know of some other software that would work with it

Since I've a VoIP adapter, and I tested that I was able to talk to some real minitel servers using a land line, I'd like to try the same thing with this modem, possibly talk to some BBS, etc... but the default software only seem to handle "talking to prestel", and ... looks like prestel is dead?

User avatar
iss
Wing Commander
Posts: 1257
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:43 pm
Location: Bulgaria
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by iss »

Using @Dbug's library: :)
Oric Owner 09 p.7 - just a review;
Oric Owner 10 p.54 - more info;

And Personal Computing Today (1985-03) p.51

It's stated that the software is on disk, so the interface should be compatible with Microdisc (at-least).
And I think I read somewhere that the used I/O is #31c which means you can try the software with Oricutron's modem emulation and/or try other programs with the RS232 interface.

User avatar
Symoon
Archivist
Posts: 1956
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 12:44 am
Location: Paris, France
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by Symoon »

Hope you can transfert the Tansoft tapes - even if no-one would use it nowadays :)
As far as I know this software wasn't available anywhere.

I'm no specialist but I recall hearing of "Oricomms" and software from Nick or Jon Haworth (was it the same software?). Not sure where to find them, or if they were missing.

User avatar
Dbug
Site Admin
Posts: 3671
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:00 pm
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by Dbug »

iss wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 11:49 am
And I think I read somewhere that the used I/O is #31c which means you can try the software with Oricutron's modem emulation and/or try other programs with the RS232 interface.
Well, the Théoric issue mentions #380 to #383, there was another modem the "Tonic" modem, so possibly they used different IO?
Hope you can transfert the Tansoft tapes - even if no-one would use it nowadays :)
As far as I know this software wasn't available anywhere.
That's planned, don't worry :)
And contrary to Loritel, these tapes load absolutely perfectly.
I'm no specialist but I recall hearing of "Oricomms" and software from Nick or Jon Haworth (was it the same software?). Not sure where to find them, or if they were missing.
No idea, but I'm interested by any mention of software, on tape or disk, manuals, reviews, etc... that provide insight on how to use this thing.
I did you buy it to just have it on the shelf, I want to make it work :)

Yicker
Pilot Officer
Posts: 97
Joined: Thu Jan 26, 2006 11:27 pm
Location: St. Helens, Merseyside, UK

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by Yicker »

Hi.

I think I have a copy of Oricomms on tape somewhere in my loft and I might also have the user guide or some sort of document that came with it.

If I get chance at the weekend, I'll have a look.


Cheers
Scott

User avatar
Dbug
Site Admin
Posts: 3671
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:00 pm
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by Dbug »

Yicker wrote:
Fri Feb 05, 2021 2:34 pm
I think I have a copy of Oricomms on tape somewhere in my loft and I might also have the user guide or some sort of document that came with it.
If I get chance at the weekend, I'll have a look.
Would be awesome if you could find that, anything that could help use the modem :)

Apparently the original author of the software does not have it anymore:
Grocerman wrote:Although this software is/was distributed by FGC, I am in fact the author of this software (and indeed ATCOMMS too). I wrote this software as a terminal emmulator and for use with Prestel (the WWW of the day). I would be interested to hear from anyone who has used this software.... just to know how useful it is/was to them. The original inspiration for this software came to me after being quoted a hugely inflated estimate, was given to me by a software house (who at the time were going to created the software for me!). After sugestions by a friend -Trevor Shaw- ( and author of the instruction pamhlet for this software, I set about writing my first ever Machine Code program. The software took me quite a few weeks to write -as I had to familiarise myself with the 6522 ACCIA chip- and I would like to know that my efforts were worth while! I also believe that my software was the first ever available for the Oric1 and Atmos!

User avatar
iss
Wing Commander
Posts: 1257
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:43 pm
Location: Bulgaria
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by iss »

Here you are: Oricomms Ta-da-aaa! :)
oricomms.png
Attachments
oricomms.dsk.zip
(25.49 KiB) Downloaded 44 times

User avatar
ibisum
Wing Commander
Posts: 1443
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2009 8:56 am
Location: Vienna, Austria
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by ibisum »

Wow! Something tells me we are soon going to have an Oric online party ..

User avatar
HigashiJun
Flying Officer
Posts: 171
Joined: Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:29 am
Location: Tokyo (Japan)

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by HigashiJun »

:D
HigashiJun

User avatar
Dbug
Site Admin
Posts: 3671
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:00 pm
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by Dbug »

So, my problem now, is to figure out the actual pinout of the thing, obviously I can just use the modem "as is" with a BT to RJ11 adapter, but I'd like to be able to test the RS-232 interface by itself.

Basically, the situation is:
  • We have the Oric RS232 interface connected to the expansion bus, using adresses #380 (Data) , #381 (Status), #382 (Command), #383 (Control)
  • This interface has a 7 pin DIN connect which plugs in the V23 modem (which itself actually has a 8 pin DIN, but the center pin is not available on the RS232 interface)
  • Somebody added a splitter box on the interface cable, which has the 8 wires connected one to one, and labelled 1 to 8 we have:
    1. Black
    2. Red
    3. Green
    4. Orange
    5. Blue
    6. White
    7. Brown
    8. Copper
  • If we look at the schematics of the Oric Serial Interface, we see that pinout number mean the following:
    1. RxC
    2. TxD
    3. GND
    4. RTS
    5. RxD
    6. /DTR
    7. DCD
So it looks like it would be smooth sailing from there, just connect a wire on the splitter box on the right number, and then I have direct access to the RS232 connectors and I can use that to connect to my PC, or the minitel... except when I used the continuity tester to check which pin of the DIN matched which number of the box, it looks very random... and does not match the usual standard.

You can see on the photos the connection box, the back of the modem, and the color of the wires attached to each of the 7 pin DIN (please note that the orange wires and copper (shield frame) are actually connected (that would be wires 4 and 8 on the connection box).
modem_connectors_back.jpg
din_pinout_wires.jpg
connection_box.jpg
So from what I see, it does not look like they used a standard numbering for the connector pinout, else the ground would probably be the center pin instead of a side one.

So, how can I figure out which wires is what, without damaging anything?


(By the way, each time I find a new resource I'm updating the Twitter thread, so feel free to go back on Twitter to read all the attached articles, from OUM, Théoric, etc...

User avatar
iss
Wing Commander
Posts: 1257
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:43 pm
Location: Bulgaria
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by iss »

A la Decouverte du Telestrat p.203 (available for CEO members):
prise_minitel.png
plus Telestrat schematics by Fred:
modem_conn.png
will give you idea how to connect the interface - follow ACIA 6551 pins to the DIN-8 connector pins.

BTW, why not use first real Telestrat to check if the modem works and if it's OK then use the interface with Atmos. ;)

User avatar
Dbug
Site Admin
Posts: 3671
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:00 pm
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by Dbug »

I would have followed the pins... if the interface had not been covered in cast black plastic mold thingy.
The guy who wrote Oricomms disassembled one and wrote to not attempt to do that, it would result in a damaged interface.

Regarding the Telestrat, that's a good point, did not thought of that, that being said, how can we be sure that the pinout is actually the same?

Also for testing with the Telestrat would imply I actually know how to use it, and that it actually works at all, I've not tested it since I bought it and burnt it the very same day 20 years ago by plugging-in the wrong power connector :)

Question: I do have one of these cheap usb logic analyzers, do you think it is safe to just plug cable on the 8 inputs and run one of these communication software to see if I get some signal on the pin 2?

User avatar
iss
Wing Commander
Posts: 1257
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:43 pm
Location: Bulgaria
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by iss »

Dbug wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 1:47 pm
I would have followed the pins... if the interface had not been covered in cast black plastic mold thingy.
The guy who wrote Oricomms disassembled one and wrote to not attempt to do that, it would result in a damaged interface.
No, no, I mean to follow the links on the both schematics - Telestrat and the SteveM's one.
I was thinking that SteveM's one represent what IS in the box. Anyway...
Dbug wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 1:47 pm
Question: I do have one of these cheap usb logic analyzers, do you think it is safe to just plug cable on the 8 inputs and run one of these communication software to see if I get some signal on the pin 2?
This is very good idea! But safety first:
This analyzer works with max input voltage up to 5.25V HERE and HERE.
From the schematics (Telestrat, SteveM's) and from the picture of modem internals - there is no evidence that there can be more than 5V on the DIN-8 connectors. Just for any case use V-meter to check the voltage on every pin of the interface (i.e. 1...8 in the splitter box) and of the modem's connector. If all is below 5.25V you can go try to start transmission from the software and search the pulses in the splitter box ... maybe this will help to find the TX line, potential problem can be the missing DCD signal ... but it's worth to try :).

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PS. I using the same analyzer just right now, but more details hopefully tomorrow:
20210206_165348.jpg

User avatar
Dbug
Site Admin
Posts: 3671
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:00 pm
Location: Oslo, Norway
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by Dbug »

I was thinking that SteveM's one represent what IS in the box. Anyway...
Anyway indeed :D

So, I wanted to run one of these communication software, and to make it easier, I hacked my Cumana Reborn by adding a connector on the cable, so I can connect the serial interface and the Cumana at the same time.

I tried to launch some of the communication software, but not very successfully:
- Oricomms does not boot at all, it stays on "insert system disk" (the DSK file boots fine on Oricutron)
- OTRM shows me a black screen, with a blue bar at the bottom, and some 0 | 1 |2 |3 | 4 | 5 markers and stops there
- Oricall does boot and shows a menu, not sure what it requires though :)

I measured the voltage, and it looks like it does not gets above 4.5 volts on the largest point.

User avatar
iss
Wing Commander
Posts: 1257
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 5:43 pm
Location: Bulgaria
Contact:

Re: Oric V23 Modem

Post by iss »

Dbug wrote:
Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:34 pm
- OTRM shows me a black screen, with a blue bar at the bottom, and some 0 | 1 |2 |3 | 4 | 5 markers and stops there
OTRM is hard coded for ACIA at $31C!
Attached is OTRM-special :) for you.

It contains 4 files DSK+TAP of OTRM-31C and OTRM-380 - the names are self-explaining.
Please, check if it works.
OTRM-special.zip
(78.03 KiB) Downloaded 41 times
EDIT: Attaching 2 PDFs for TCM3101 chip - FSK modem used in V23. Just for the record :)
TCM3101J.pdfs.zip
(509.16 KiB) Downloaded 33 times

Post Reply