Téléstrat frustration

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This includes generic Oric talkings and things that are totaly unrelated but want to share with people here :)
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Dbug
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Téléstrat frustration

Post by Dbug »

Hi,
I've been trying to get my Telestrat usable, but so far without much success:
- I can boot "Stratsed 2.0cq" but not "Stratoric v3.0" (real floppies)
- I tried a number of DSK versions using the Gotek, but most don't load
- I just discovered that I have a "Stratoric 1.0" cartridge that apparently can be used on the left or right side, but no idea how to use it
- As expected Erebus does not work on it
- Most of the time the reset button just shows the annoying "Software by Fabrice Broche" message (grmbl...!!!)
- I don't have a "ROMATMOS" cartridge
- I don't have the minitel din cable (not sure if it's a standard 8 pin DIN or if there's some magic in it)
etc...

So basically, I'd like to make a video about the Telestrat, but I never used one, when I had that one I managed to burn it the first day by plugin the wrong power cable, half of the time it does not boot because the cartridge connectors seem to be worn out so the contacts are bad.

Are there any tutorials on how to use the machine, list of software and how to use them, and specifically, other than minitel software, anything that shows in any way (even modest) why the Telestrat would be an actual upgrade from the Atmos?

So far all I see is complexity, incompatibility, hardware design madness, and confusing naming of things.

Like, can you use a Sedoric floppy with Atmos software on a Telestrat?
What's the difference between Sedoric, Stratsed, Stratoric, etc...

Bonus question: My two Hitach HFD305D drive refuse to boot on the Stratsed floppies, and generally speaking are doing horribly noises, like crackling and like things in contact with each other while rotating instead of smooth silent action, any idea what could cause that and if there's some proper hardware maintenance to do? (like grease something maybe?)

If you are interested by me getting frustrated by the machine, a Twitter thread:
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ibisum
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by ibisum »

Oddly enough I was just looking at my Telestrat and wondering if I should get on with getting it to boot too .. but I thought to myself 'I'll probably need to lean on the DF guys a lot for this one", and put it aside .. checked DF .. and here you are, with your very own Telestrat recovery thread. But you were supposed to help me with mine! :)

I've got the ROMATMOS cartridge - is it worth trying to make a dump of this? I think you kind of need it for Telestrat ..
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Dbug
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by Dbug »

What I suggest is that you share your experience.
The ROMATMOS is available as files, that's not really the problem, it's more a case of having it on an actual cartridge :)
Actually what would be nice is some universal flashable cartridge where you could put what you want, but that would be quite a limited market.

My attempt with the Erebus was to see if I could use it as a kind of RomAtmos since it takes over the ROM, but apparently that conflicts with the Telestrat built-in banking system (which I expected really).

Regarding booting your own Telestrat, the only important things are:
- To plug the proper connector on the Telestrat, they have the same type of DIN 4 connectors but not the same voltages, using the wrong one damages the machine (or the disk drive)
- To only plug a slave microdisc, not one with a microdisc controller board
- Never swap cartridges with the Telestrat on.
and I guess that's it, if you get that right, there should be no risk to damage anything.

One thing for sure, on mine the contacts of the cartridges are not reliable, if HyperBasic is pushed down properly, it will not work, I have to get it about 2mm from bottoming, else it just gets stuck on the colored garbage screen.
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ibisum
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by ibisum »

>What I suggest is that you share your experience.

I'm pretty sure I plugged the wrong disc drive into my Telestrat last year and fried it. I was not as careful as I should have been .. and now I'm frankly a little timid about trying to boot it up - I'd only ever booted it once successfully before. But yes, I think this week I will put it on the workbench and lets see if we can't get both our systems up, too.

I think I have to replace some chips though. :(

>One thing for sure, on mine the contacts of the cartridges are not reliable, if HyperBasic is pushed down properly, it will not work, I have to get it about 2mm from bottoming, else it just gets stuck on the colored garbage screen.


Might work with some solder blobs on the contact pads, maybe?
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iss
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by iss »

ibisum wrote: Sat Mar 06, 2021 11:10 am >One thing for sure, on mine the contacts of the cartridges are not reliable, if HyperBasic is pushed down properly, it will not work, I have to get it about 2mm from bottoming, else it just gets stuck on the colored garbage screen.

Might work with some solder blobs on the contact pads, maybe?
No, I can't recommend this - it may solve temporary the problem with one particular cartridge, but it will definitely bend the pins in the connector and most probably there will be never good contact. Only careful cleaning of both PCB connector and the cartridge's edge connector with alcohol or contact spray ...and some pray :).

Else, you guys really scared me - what I should expect when I power-on any of my THREE Telestrats :mrgreen:
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by Dbug »

iss wrote: Sat Mar 06, 2021 1:05 pm Else, you guys really scared me - what I should expect when I power-on any of my THREE Telestrats :mrgreen:
Well, if you blow them, it's your fault, because you've been informed.

It's the difference between dying on a mine-field you did not know was there, versus ignoring the signs telling there's a mine-field.
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by Symoon »

I agree Telestrat is a real mess, and no dedicated doc explains how to plug properly, how to build the right cables, plug the cartidges and so on. I started a doc about cartridges last year, but the Covid stopped me (my Telestrats are far from my living home). I also think I still have a cartridge at Nightbird's home, and another one from René who lended me one for a test... Ouch, anyway.
Dbug wrote: Sat Mar 06, 2021 10:59 am Regarding booting your own Telestrat, the only important things are:
- To plug the proper connector on the Telestrat, they have the same type of DIN 4 connectors but not the same voltages, using the wrong one damages the machine (or the disk drive)
- To only plug a slave microdisc, not one with a microdisc controller board
- Never swap cartridges with the Telestrat on.
and I guess that's it, if you get that right, there should be no risk to damage anything.
I would add:
- check carefully how you plug the power on the Telestrat. It's a round plug, pin holes are not vertically aligned, and nothing prevents from very easily inserting the wrong pins in the wrong holes
- don't use an Oric/Atmos peritel (scart) cable. It's a specific cable for the Telestrat.
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by Symoon »

BTW @Dbug, if I'm not mistaken, Telemon is the name of the system kernel and has to be present as a bank, on the left cartridge.
It's not present in cartidges such as the Oric/Atmos emulator, or (obviously) RAM cartidges.
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Dbug
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by Dbug »

Today I played a bit with Stratoric (thanks Symoon for some information yesterday):


In the page 2 of the Statoric documentation it says it's possible to boot on the ROM 1.0 (Oric 1) by pressing "1" during the boot, but that did not work for me, maybe because I don't have a Statoric 1.0 disk (I only have a 3.0 and 4.0).

If I boot with Statoric 3.0 I do have a usable os (I can start Krillys, install the Oric 1 rom, etc...) if I boot on the "Strat40u" I got from oric.org, I get a boot menu with a french and british flag, followed by an "Invalid file name error in 200".

Any idea?
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iss
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by iss »

Dbug wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 12:01 pm Any idea?
By unknown reason the file STRAT40u.DSK from oric.org is SEDORIC 4.0 and boots fine ONLY in Oric-1 and Atmos mode. Obviously not related to Telestrat ;).
Screenshot_20210307_151312.png
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by Dbug »

Is it possible that somebody fumbled and named things incorrectly?
Like if it was not already complicated to use this damned machine :D
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iss
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by iss »

Dbug wrote: Sun Mar 07, 2021 2:54 pm Like if it was not already complicated to use this damned machine :D
Yep, the biggest problem for me is to remember what all that names actually mean - STRA...this, STRA...that :?
Anyway, else I find the idea for ROM-less machine as very cool, but you are right - it's still kind of "beta" version.

Here is how I replaced the ugly power connector some time ago, using DIN-7 and removing 3 pins.
It would be great if I can find such DIN connector in RED or other color 8)
teleconn.gif
(it's animated gif click on it to see other frames)
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by ibisum »

This looks like its gonna be a great thread. Dbug, you're pounding through the wilderness with a big stick .. its motivating. :)

What I think happened with mine is, I have too much Oric stuff, and the drives that were specifically built for my Telestrat rig by its original owner, were not the ones that were plugged in. It did work though - I just ended up shelving it for my Atmos, which is a bit more comfy.

Anyway s soon as I can I am going to try to get my Telestrat on the workbench, and ready to check signals to find whats up.

I would, I suppose, start with the external disk drives first, and be sure they're in order.

.. has anyone found a Telestrat service manual or schematic or test plan, by any chance?
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by soft-bug »

Hi Dbug,

Same frustation here for me ...

I share you this :

https://forum.system-cfg.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=11049

And i hope a new hope (for me) :

https://forum.system-cfg.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=12002
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Dbug
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Re: Téléstrat frustration

Post by Dbug »

soft-bug wrote: Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:36 pm Hi Dbug,

Same frustation here for me ...

I share you this :

https://forum.system-cfg.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=11049

And i hope a new hope (for me) :

https://forum.system-cfg.com/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=12002
Ouch, did not know about the 1793 used as a fuse :shock: :roll:

Reading the thing was interesting, I did not know that:
- It was possible to do a proper reset by using RESET button + DEL key (so I was doing OFF ON all the time)
- that doing OFF/ON too fast was a good recipe to burn the telestrat (!!!)
- that many of the telestrat PSU don't deliver the proper voltages after a while
- that the -12v is apparently only required for Telestrat that have the serial number <1000
- that the cartridge requiring a mm of wiggle is a known issue

This machine is scary...
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