Oricium feedback and review thread

Want to talks about games you like, would like to see developed on the Oric, it's here.
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Chema
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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Chema » Thu Sep 04, 2014 8:29 pm

@Dom, perfect! I am sure some people here will be glad to play oricium with a joystick :)

@peacer, not sure what it could be. The game is loading perfectly, as it boots and also the wav is using the crc checking every 256 bytes, so if the game auto runs, it's been loaded without errors.

I'd bet you are right about the program failing to detect the vsync hack. And I am not sure why. The only thing is that the hack plugs the sync signal through the tape-in, and the auto detection tries to detect pulses in that signal. Maybe your player generates some kind of signal in the tape plug when the game finishes loading which, in turn, is detected as the sync signal.

When the text is plotted, each letter is printed after waiting for an sync, so this kind of noise or signal keeps lasting for a while.

Not sure. Have you tried loading using another device, such as a PC?

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Symoon » Thu Sep 04, 2014 9:58 pm

Chema wrote:@peacer, not sure what it could be. The game is loading perfectly, as it boots and also the wav is using the crc checking every 256 bytes, so if the game auto runs, it's been loaded without errors.
Well I had the exact same problem than Peacer.
Strange!
The question sounds stupid but: are you 100% sure you are Cloading the same WAV than the one Peacer and I have downloaded?

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Chema » Thu Sep 04, 2014 10:42 pm

Then it is a bug. I'll check with my own Oric and see if the vsync hack detection is being fooled by cassette noise or something.

And I will check the wav is the correct one too... The question now is if anybody was able to load it without problems....

Btw Symoon, you said that converting the tap to normal fast speed worked for you?

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by peacer » Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:08 pm

Yes, I think that he problem is not related with loading error. I've checked many other wav files and games, and none of them were failed. Loading of the game is not the problem I guess..

I've checked it with android tablet and PC, other than my mp3 player device, again the same occured.

Then I had an idea when you said "When the text is plotted, each letter is printed after waiting for an sync, so this kind of noise or signal keeps lasting for a while."

The game is hanging as soon as wav play is stopped after loading. Maybe the time of play after starting of the game lets oric to plot that half sentence.

After hang up, I rewind the wav file and play it again.. And strange thing happens, the game keeps on running as long as oric hears something from tape-in :)

The cable plugged into tape-in of Oric works as if I have vsync hack as long as data is received.

The gameplay and scroll is perfect, without flickering but really quite faster than PC emulator run. The screens that give explanations shows up so quickly one after another, nearly impossible to read . I manage to run the game by pressing the p key. Again the gameplay is also very fast but I am able to play it as long as mp3 player keeps on playing the wav file. When wav stops, game stops too.

Maybe you can create a version which is not running on automated vsync and always ask for manual sync.

Note that, my tape cable let me hear anyting thru oric's speaker.

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Chema » Fri Sep 05, 2014 9:35 am

That is probably it then. If some signal of any kind enters through tape-in and produces changes in CB1, it would be detected as if VSync is present. After this occurs, in many places the game will wait for an IRQ such as if VSync were there. More noise or signals in tape-in will be interpreted as a vertical retrace.

Okay, I can remove the detection until the "PLUG VSYNC CABLE OR PRESS A KEY" message, and perform it just after the user presses the key. That would add another keypress to run the game in systems where the VSync is there or emulated and won't prevent the user to keep feeding noise through the tape-in, confusing the system.

I can try to time the lapse between two IRQs in the detection method and see if they are 20ms away (more or less). If not, then it is not a Sync signal, else it is... This may complicate a bit the detection routine, but may be worth it.

I am against the option of keeping two different versions though.

Not sure if Dbug, who is the original author of the detection routine, has any further idea...

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Godzil » Fri Sep 05, 2014 9:50 am

Chema wrote:That is probably it then. If some signal of any kind enters through tape-in and produces changes in CB1, it would be detected as if VSync is present. After this occurs, in many places the game will wait for an IRQ such as if VSync were there. More noise or signals in tape-in will be interpreted as a vertical retrace.

Okay, I can remove the detection until the "PLUG VSYNC CABLE OR PRESS A KEY" message, and perform it just after the user presses the key. That would add another keypress to run the game in systems where the VSync is there or emulated and won't prevent the user to keep feeding noise through the tape-in, confusing the system.

I can try to time the lapse between two IRQs in the detection method and see if they are 20ms away (more or less). If not, then it is not a Sync signal, else it is... This may complicate a bit the detection routine, but may be worth it.

I am against the option of keeping two different versions though.

Not sure if Dbug, who is the original author of the detection routine, has any further idea...
Chema: You may prefer to ask at the beginning, but you can also simply add an option in the menu to activate the hardware vsync or calibrate the software one?

Or have a simple "wait" of a few sec with "Press any key if you have the hardware vsync, of wait X sec"

and if the user press a key, do the HVsync detection, grumble if you can't detect it and tel the user to press a key to retry detection or esc to use the software one,
or if the user didnt press any key just go to the software calibrated one, with still an option in the menu to switch between hard/soft vsync

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by peacer » Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:12 pm

User respond other than automatically detection would be the best solution..

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Chema » Fri Sep 05, 2014 5:05 pm

Will look into this guys. Give me some time. I am currently too busy at work.

I wonder why there is any signal in the audio after the load, though. I'd expect silence...

EDIT: just tested in my Atmos with my smartphone and I also have the issue. In my case it hangs with the Oricium logo and playing the main tune.

I guess it depends on what the player does at the end of the wav. Certainly it loads without errors. Just replay the wav to make the program continue and even press P to play. You'll see the game running at nearly full CPU speed. Impressive, though tearing is quite visible ;)

Probably letting the user decide and remove auto detection is the best way to go...

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by peacer » Fri Sep 05, 2014 6:13 pm

Thanks :)

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Symoon » Sat Sep 06, 2014 7:49 am

Chema wrote:Btw Symoon, you said that converting the tap to normal fast speed worked for you?
Yes, I wanted to do the test with the same player I used to load the Tap2CD version. => 1st loading, success.
Glad to see you guys seem to have found the problem source.

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Chema » Sat Sep 27, 2014 7:53 pm

Hi guys. I've been terribly busy lately, so sorry for being so late with this. I think I found a nice solution to this problem, simple adding a PRESS KEY message under the loading pic once the game finishes loading.

This gives time to stop the player, and keeps the nice loading pic Dbug made :).

I also included the patches by Symoon and tested everything under Euphoric, Oricutron in 1 and Atmos mode and with my own Atmos using my Android smartphone. It worked nicely, even with ultra fast loading (tap2cd) and after booting oricdos with my cumulus attached. No interference with the tape loading.

So, is there anything else to include for a 1.1 release? I only find the joystick missing, but I am not sure to include it in this first update.

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Dbug » Sat Sep 27, 2014 8:59 pm

You mean, 1.2 ;)
There's already a 1.1 out there :D

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Chema » Sun Sep 28, 2014 6:30 pm

Ah yes... Well it is not a different version, just Symoon's hack to make it load on an Oric 1 and on Euphoric (the header format thing).

I included these (thanks Symoon) and the pause to avoid noise being confused with the Vhack sync present. Not many changes, but should order thigs a bit. I will name it 1.2 as you suggest.

Any other bug that needs correction? If not, I will update the file in a couple of days...

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by peacer » Sun Sep 28, 2014 10:11 pm

So, will this pause perevent system that vsync is present?

I'll check it on my Atmos :) Thanks

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Re: Oricium feedback and review thread

Post by Chema » Sun Sep 28, 2014 10:17 pm

peacer wrote:So, will this pause perevent system that vsync is present?

I'll check it on my Atmos :) Thanks
Yep. I tested it and seems to work. As it asks the user to press a key, you can stop the player, disconnect it or whatever.

I'll post the new version soon, so you can test.

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